We are the Hobby Options

[Night Reaper]

Hey guys,

http://natfka.blogspot.com.au/2012/06/deep...hobby.html#more

Saw this earlier today and thought it was worth sharing around as much as possible. It raises some very interesting points, and after reading it I'm starting to reconsider some of my views of GW.

Let's try and keep this reasonable, no mass degradation of GW, just stay on topic.

Thanks

Night Reaper

[Lacrimosa]

There's other manufacturers you know.

[cmdr_roy]

Ian, dont troll.

[Golden Gecko]

Let's try and keep this reasonable, no mass degradation of GW, just stay on topic.

Calling all Wombats...

[Biggy]

Really interesting article with a lot of valid points. Wells is still waaaaaay out of touch though.

[Lacrimosa]

Ian, dont troll.

Seriously mang. GW is just a company that sells some plastic dudes. Essays aren't necessary.

[RandomAbuse]

Seriously mang. GW is just a company that sells some plastic dudes. Essays aren't necessary.

Probably not. But the article also addressed the community and what they can do to make the game more fun, which was quite interesting.

[Mephyuser39]

The original author raised some interesting points and Jes Goodwin has my pity that he can't talk to us without copping a heap of vitriole about the work he does.

But, GW does need to realise that another of his points is also true. If GW shut it's doors tomorrow, The hobby would survive. The community of players would barely notice the fact that there would be no more new minatures and it would simply find other ways to get the minis it wanted, even just specific parts. How many of us have a large bits box? How many of us can use E-bay?

I mean that GW needs us. We only need GW if we play one of it's games.

GW provides a good product. Its just the pricing policy that needs a little tweaking.

END OF RANT

Just a question out of interest. Who was introduced to the game by a friend and who was brought into the game by advertising.

I was introduced by a friend

FRIEND : 1
ADVERTISING : 0

[Night Reaper]

Just a question out of interest. Who was introduced to the game by a friend and who was brought into the game by advertising.

I was introduced by a friend

FRIEND : 1
ADVERTISING : 0

Friend

[chromedog]

I was introduced to wargaming by my granddad (who played napoleonics).
I discovered other games indirectly through a friend who told me about a games convention - where I discovered Battletech (this was one of the old Tin soldier ones, in the old Haymarket TAFE campus.). Later I found Tin Soldier.

Later, I discovered 40k by looking at the rulebook in a store (there were NO GW stores in this country at that point, and Sydney still had a Mind Games.).

I found other people who played and they became my friends. I didn't introduce friends to it (gaming), they were already gamers when we were introduced.

The one thing that irks me about contemporary gamers is the almost evangelical hate from the "converts" to other games from GW (they seem to wear gaming blinders). You don't have to be exclusive to one plastic-producing idol. One can have a gaming pantheon and be quite happy.

This post has been edited by chromedog: Jun 11 2012, 07:35 PM

[Aegnor]

Friend

[Greatwolf Glen]

I was introduced to wargaming by my granddad (who played napoleonics).
I discovered other games indirectly through a friend who told me about a games convention - where I discovered Battletech.

Later, I discovered 40k by looking at the rulebook in a store (there were NO GW stores in this country at that point, and Sydney still had a Mind Games.).

I found other people who played and they became my friends. I didn't introduce friends to it (gaming), they were already gamers when we were introduced.

The one thing that irks me about contemporary gamers is the almost evangelical hate from the "converts" to other games from GW (they seem to wear gaming blinders). You don't have to be exclusive to one plastic-producing idol. One can have a gaming pantheon and be quite happy.

+1 Chromedog I can remember when mind games was still going, I was introduced to the GW hobby by a friend but we played other games as well, quiet a few role play games which I still play occasionally.

Yeah some gamers don't get the big picture there are other companies that produce alternate miniatures for 40K, or totally different gaming systems if you want e.g. our gaming group also play dystopian wars, malifaux, and sedition wars looks good.

Even the old GW specialist games, like blood bowl, necromunda and mordheim you can source alternate models from other gaming systems which provide good alternatives to GW models.

[Gorechilds Protege]

Even the old GW specialist games, like blood bowl, necromunda and mordheim you can source alternate models from other gaming systems which provide good alternatives to GW models.

Mordheim's a great example of the community not needing GW - GW screwed over our wonderful community yet expansions and new warbands balanced to those expansions and those settings as well as the game as a whole have been released within the external to GW (granted many players were from the old Mordheim forums before the royal ###### up with SG Forums being set up which lost so many players outright) community. There's other systems in the same sort of genre and style as Mordheim and it being a skirmish game pretty much any company that produces fantasy miniatures can be used as the models. It's the being mature enough to evolve past the GW store to an Independent store which isn't GW Biased and then going from there beyond that can be a real sticking point for some people who buy into the fallacy that GW sells the only good models on the market.

[Greatwolf Glen]

Mordheim's a great example of the community not needing GW - GW screwed over our wonderful community yet expansions and new warbands balanced to those expansions and those settings as well as the game as a whole have been released within the external to GW (granted many players were from the old Mordheim forums before the royal ###### up with SG Forums being set up which lost so many players outright) community. There's other systems in the same sort of genre and style as Mordheim and it being a skirmish game pretty much any company that produces fantasy miniatures can be used as the models. It's the being mature enough to evolve past the GW store to an Independent store which isn't GW Biased and then going from there beyond that can be a real sticking point for some people who buy into the fallacy that GW sells the only good models on the market.

+1 and this is a problem for the gaming community and a massive win for GW when some gamers have no perception on what's good value in terms of getting bang for your buck dollar wise, yes 10+ years ago yes they where the dominant player in the market but this has not been true for a number of years now, and yet they still act like they produce the only good models in the market place.

[s1viter0]

I came to the hobby from a different angle. I found Dawn of War. That was a revelation after playing Age of Empires forever. From there, I found out my bro in law was a very talented modeller and painter, and he made me a Tau Commander. After a while, he looked lonely all on his own, so I started building an army from there. About a year later, I have about 2500-3000 points of painted Tau, and a DE on the way.

As for the article, I also find it sad that the creators of these minis can't relate to us as the gamers. Sure, I don't like paying more than I have to, but on a model per model basis, the prices aren't THAT bad. Ok, finecast excepted there. But, GW is a company, companies make money, else there is no company. End of story. How they choose to do that can be debated till the squats come home, but in the end, GW know we want their product and they make a good one, so they set their prices accordingly in their minds.

Anyway, it was an interesting read, with some valid points. thanks for sharing.

[Golden Gecko]

I was introduced to wargaming by my granddad (who played napoleonics).
I discovered other games indirectly through a friend who told me about a games convention - where I discovered Battletech (this was one of the old Tin soldier ones, in the old Haymarket TAFE campus.). Later I found Tin Soldier.

Later, I discovered 40k by looking at the rulebook in a store (there were NO GW stores in this country at that point, and Sydney still had a Mind Games.).

I found other people who played and they became my friends. I didn't introduce friends to it (gaming), they were already gamers when we were introduced.

The one thing that irks me about contemporary gamers is the almost evangelical hate from the "converts" to other games from GW (they seem to wear gaming blinders). You don't have to be exclusive to one plastic-producing idol. One can have a gaming pantheon and be quite happy.

I now understand where the 'chrome' in your username comes from...
Unfortunately, my hair didnt go grey, it just packed its bags and left

[Juisarian]

When it comes to things like rumours, tutorials and tactica, the Internet is my go-to guy. GW's contribution in these areas is negligible. Who needs White Dwarf when you have any of the great wargaming sites or blogs, let alone all of them?

When it comes to a free and open discussion of the game and the products, I know I can go to my local independent retailer for good advice and a chat. I don't even like to think about what happens when I step into a GW shop. Nice range of products in stock, terrible people to deal with.

TOURNAMENTS, TOURNAMENTS, TOURNAMENTS. The fact that there are multiple tournaments a year in a place like SA alone that run and prosper entirely without GW involvement is the single most important argument that we run this hobby.

GW contributes the rules, the models and the fluff. We are the hobby.

This post has been edited by Juisarian: Jun 12 2012, 09:26 AM

[Reunion-Round]

TOURNAMENTS, TOURNAMENTS, TOURNAMENTS. The fact that there are multiple tournaments a year in a place like SA alone that run and prosper entirely without GW involvement is the single most important argument that we run this hobby.

Same argument can be made against any company though.

This post has been edited by Reunion-Round: Jun 12 2012, 11:07 AM

[Juisarian]

Same argument can be made against company though.

If you mean "against any company" I think the difference is that most other wargaming companies don't have a local physical infrastructure of shops of staff. Most of them don't even have a corporate office in Australia or NZ.

[Sgtdurst72]

Nice article, honestly I agree with it, in particular a site he mentioned literally has thousands of battle reports, how to play step by steps for many of it systems alongside painting and modeling tutorials accusing such places as freeloading is a slap to the face.

I co run a small gaming group of around fifteen members "howd you start?" is a pretty standard question. The answer is usually a friend/family member played..... Not I was walking past a GW and a overly enthusiastic sales person hurled information at me until I bought something so I could leave.


When profits falter and the company begins to sink their attitude may change for the better or for the worse, but people are still playing and paying so I can't see that happening anytime soon

Ow and a friend

This post has been edited by Sgtdurst72: Jun 12 2012, 10:43 AM