Basing bits for diorama?, Need recommendations of vendors and/or techniques ... Options

[kajh]

Guys,

Need your brains and experience.

I was wondering if I could ask you for good vendors and/or techniques. I have a bunch of ideas at the moment for the end-of-year challenge, but I'm not sure if they're achievable and was wondering what you all thought.

My idea is to do a diorama where I can have the malenthrope, captured by the imperium, is shackled to a wall in a bunker-like cylinder on the RHS of the model, with the LHS being metal-grille-type stairs up to the model's head/eye-level. Perhaps there will be a door there at the top of the stairs where the captors come in to poke/prod/test the malenthrope occasionally.

The model will not be symmetric - the RHS (containment cylinder) will dominate the model - the LHS is to provide more detail and flesh out the 'story' a bit.

The cylinder will be a thick-concrete shell, with small, cut-inspection windows in it and pipes hanging off it. Very rusty and delapidated - obviously not well maintained with manky water running down the walls. The bunker/cylinder will be a cut-away so that you can see into it from the outside of the model in. Critters and gunk will be at ground level, hinting at it being part of a bigger network of pipes.

For LHS of the diorama, I need to have metal stair up to a malenthrope-head-level inspection port with one (or two) guys on the railing looking in (one with a clipboard if I can manage it; not sure whether these will be imperial guard guys or whether I can find good models like a imperial tech priest/servitor/scientist dude et al.). Not quite sure of the details on the LHS yet - need to firm up my mental picture of the story.

Anyway - with the above, I need some help!

1) Any suggestions on the concrete piping/shell? I'll need something with a diameter > 60mm (the model base) to give a feeling of size - it's a containment cell;

2) Chains shackling the malenthrope to the wall? I've heard that jewelery chain works well.

3) Scale stairs and walls? I have a sheet of metal modelling grill (used to paint this dude) and some plasticard to build the struts. Should be okay to scratch-build but am wondering if these things can be bought to save time.

4) The base itself. Steve - how do you do those wood bases with bevelled edges? Or, should I go for something into which I could pour resin for water effects?

I've found this site which might be able to get me some of the bits I need. Anyone else good some good sources?

Thanks very much for your help!

Cya,
Andrew.

[kajh]

Just discovered the plastruct catalogue. Looks like they have a bunch of stuff.

Remember looking here a while ago (since forgotten).

Cya,
Andrew.

[korocite]

G'day Andrew,

I really like your ideas for this project.

Re. the bevelled base, some I do myself eg the SAW base using a band saw with a tiltable table. You can borrow mine if you want to go this way. It is only good for pretty thin material eg mdf to about 6mm or chipboard to about 10mm. The baseI used for the dragon was found at the Thornleigh Bunnings in the craft section (next to paint). They have quite a few similar bases that are intended for name plaques.

Re. the cyclinder, I have had success with cardboard tubes eg Pringles chip tubes. You would probably need to hunt around the supermarket with a ruler to get one for the inner surface of the wall and a slightly larger one for the outer wall to give it some thickness. I wish I had some pics of a terrain piece that I built (and left) in Adelaide. It was a rusty metal tower, (not concrete as you intend to do) using cardboard strips to simulate layers of metal and pins everywhere for rivets.

As for pipes, there are heaps of diameters of plastic and brass tubing available from hobby shops but they are pretty pricey for what you get and I don't expect you would need much. I can give you a few bits and pieces if you want to avoid buying way more than you will use. Alternatively, I recall a really good pipe/tube set I saw once at Toms hobbies West Ryde. The advantage of this set was that it had curved/right angle pieces and a few different diameters in the one pack from memory. There is a slim chance I may be able to get down there on Monday. If so, I will have a look.

As for chain, you could always try twin plaza metals

http://www.twinplaza.com/Home.aspx

There is not much to see on their website, but a visit to their store in the city is always interesting (I can't recommend their jewellers saw enough).

I don't have any decent ideas for the staircase. If you were to make it out of concrete blocks eg the Hirst art bricks, then I could help you with that.

Steve

[Plebicidal]

You could check out HO scaled stairs from train store etc, but your best bet would to build them yourself.
Ive never found any that look decent in 28mm scale for sale individually.
You could always look into 1.35 scale model kits though.

Definitely jewelers chain.

I would try the wooden base, then build a removable 'wall' around the edge so you can use the water effects too!

+1 to the pringles can.
You alse have a good excuse to eat the pringles too!

[lobo]

Look at the plastic pvc piping in bunnings. There are joiners and things that have a ridge around the base that look like reinforcing. Give it a sand and an undercoat with some texture spray and you have instant big diameter containment. Also, Pipes, plastic drinking straws filled with plaster are sturdy and have any angle you want on the bendy ones. There are also many different diameter ones if you are willing to go to a few different establishments that sell beverages.

As for the base, your best friend is the black stuff or grey stuff or whatever it is called that you can mould into a base. with that you can mould up whatever dips and hollows you feel necessary. An added touch that I have liked with every diorama that I have seen done really well is to include something under the ground. A touch of glowing fungus, Goblins digging a mine, skeleton and buried treasure. Whatever it is, you can add an extra element to the story by putting something underground. Don't forget that this can be a 360 degree view so you can have something or someone trying to free the beast as the "good" guys are studying how to wipe out the threat.

Try for servitors as the menial clipboard carrying flunkies. There are lots of them around. imperial guard commisars that are battlescarred would make a great xeno scientist as they are missing appendages due to the extreme nature of the tests they are conducting.

[kajh]

Hi Steve!

I really like your ideas for this project.

Thanks! Looks good in my head - let's see if I can pull a half-decent effort off!

Re. the bevelled base, some I do myself eg the SAW base using a band saw with a tiltable table. You can borrow mine if you want to go this way. It is only good for pretty thin material eg mdf to about 6mm or chipboard to about 10mm. The baseI used for the dragon was found at the Thornleigh Bunnings in the craft section (next to paint). They have quite a few similar bases that are intended for name plaques.

Thanks for the offer Steve - I might take you up on it. The dragon trophy plaque base sounds like a good option - I'll try that first.

Re. the cyclinder, I have had success with cardboard tubes eg Pringles chip tubes. You would probably need to hunt around the supermarket with a ruler to get one for the inner surface of the wall and a slightly larger one for the outer wall to give it some thickness. I wish I had some pics of a terrain piece that I built (and left) in Adelaide. It was a rusty metal tower, (not concrete as you intend to do) using cardboard strips to simulate layers of metal and pins everywhere for rivets.

Nevermind. Would be good to see.

As for pipes, there are heaps of diameters of plastic and brass tubing available from hobby shops but they are pretty pricey for what you get and I don't expect you would need much. I can give you a few bits and pieces if you want to avoid buying way more than you will use. Alternatively, I recall a really good pipe/tube set I saw once at Toms hobbies West Ryde. The advantage of this set was that it had curved/right angle pieces and a few different diameters in the one pack from memory. There is a slim chance I may be able to get down there on Monday. If so, I will have a look.

I'll check out the Hornsby store - see what they have. If you do head near the West Ryde store - it would be very much appreciated. If not - no dramas, and thanks for the offer.

As for chain, you could always try twin plaza metals

http://www.twinplaza.com/Home.aspx

There is not much to see on their website, but a visit to their store in the city is always interesting (I can't recommend their jewellers saw enough).

Client's in the city at the moment - will make time to get over there!

I don't have any decent ideas for the staircase. If you were to make it out of concrete blocks eg the Hirst art bricks, then I could help you with that.

Thanks Steve - I don't think I'll do concrete stairs - not quite what I'm looking for. Have a bunch of good visual references at the moment for cold-war missile silos. (eg. here, here and here.) Need rusty iron and stuff embedded in the concrete - can do that.

Cya,
Andrew.

[kajh]

You could check out HO scaled stairs from train store etc, but your best bet would to build them yourself. Ive never found any that look decent in 28mm scale for sale individually. You could always look into 1.35 scale model kits though.

Will look into them - otherwise - building myself might be the go. If I get lazy, could always go the ladder route.

Definitely jewelers chain.

Cool.

I would try the wooden base, then build a removable 'wall' around the edge so you can use the water effects too!

Mmmm ... good idea. Thinking, thinking ...
Cya,
Andrew.

This post has been edited by kajh: Jun 3 2012, 10:16 AM

[kajh]

Look at the plastic pvc piping in bunnings. There are joiners and things that have a ridge around the base that look like reinforcing. Give it a sand and an undercoat with some texture spray and you have instant big diameter containment. Also, Pipes, plastic drinking straws filled with plaster are sturdy and have any angle you want on the bendy ones. There are also many different diameter ones if you are willing to go to a few different establishments that sell beverages.

Lobo - like your thinking. The PVC pipes might be the go here, given I know you can get different widths. Will have to have a look - things which will trip me up are the default sizes they provide and the width of the materials (PVC piping is heavy-duty for models).

A touch of glowing fungus, Goblins digging a mine, skeleton and buried treasure. Whatever it is, you can add an extra element to the story by putting something underground. Don't forget that this can be a 360 degree view so you can have something or someone trying to free the beast as the "good" guys are studying how to wipe out the threat.

MUST HAVE!

Try for servitors as the menial clipboard carrying flunkies. There are lots of them around. imperial guard commisars that are battlescarred would make a great xeno scientist as they are missing appendages due to the extreme nature of the tests they are conducting.

Thanks for this - have to spend some time with the catalogue ...
Cya,
Andrew.

This post has been edited by kajh: Jun 3 2012, 10:21 AM

[kajh]

Okay - keeping this thread for questions - I'll post progress to the painting thread.

Did what Steve suggested and bought some chain from TwinPlaza in the city - interesting place. Two types of chain plus a couple of joiner-things (to anchor the chain to the wall).

Problem is - I think one chain looks good, but too small to hold a malenthrope; the other looks hefty enough, but looks like jewellery chain. What do you think?







Cya,
Andrew.

[Mono]

Man up and use both

Use the 2nd one to wrap around the bug and paint to look like it is binding and cutting its connection to the hive mind

use the 1st one to hold the bug in place, so paint as a heavy rusted iron chain

[korocite]

I agree that the larger chain looks a bit wrong. It is the same as spectacle chain which does not lend itself well to representing normal chain.

There are two ways that I can think of to solves this problem using only the smaller link chain.

1. Lots of chains, or

2. Have the chains attached to (or going through) sensitive bits of anatomy eg the nose ring on a bull. I can't imagine the imperium being gentle with such a beastie.

Steve

[kajh]

2. Have the chains attached to (or going through) sensitive bits of anatomy eg the nose ring on a bull. I can't imagine the imperium being gentle with such a beastie.

I plan to do this with the rings: punch holes in the carapace to attach them to plates on the wall.

Regards,
Andrew.

P.S. An update on The Plan for the diorama. Apologies for semi-random internet pics.

- Base will be something like this (have to make it). The wood block on top is important (see below).

- RHS is oversized cylinder/silo/containment chamber with Maelenthrope in it, bolted to wall. Cylinder will be domed with a single, low-slung bulb-lighting (think WW2-style cup-onna-string lights). Diorama will have a backing wall (for the bunker), but will have LHS open (implying big-ish room outside the containment chamber).

- The cylinder will have a bunch of tubes coming out at ground level - extend the model into the space occupied by the base - overhanging it.

- In the dome, there will be 'showers' - think Auschwitz. Some emergency bug-gassing vents.

- In the cylinder - around head level - there will be a door (open) with short metal walkway which provides access to bthe bug's head. On the walkway is a servitor, with it's arm attachments plugged into the bug's fleshy bits.

- Warning/rotating red light above the door on both sides. This light will be on/active (reasons below).

- On the LHS of the diorama, genestealers will have broken into the bunker (summoned by the Malenthrope) and are busy swarming out of a hole in the floor.

- The hole in the floor will be connected to an equivalent tunnel hole in the 'wood block' part of the base, into which you can see another genestealer entering. (ie. The base will form part of the diorama/story.)

- The genestealers have just broken through - the diorama is at that moment, with the confusion of the attack.

- Three imperial guard were sitting on army/collapsable chairs playing cards around a barrel/crate (cards will be on top), moments before the attack. They are in different states of reaction - all have their mouths open, yelling.

- One guard (closest to the hole) has a genestealer rending claw clamped over his head, being yanked backwards.

- One guard is standing, reaching for a lasgun/bolt pistol (that he'll likely never get);

- One guard is turning around yelling an alert towards the containment chamber.

- On the outside of the cylinder there is another short walkway and then steps/ladder to the ground level. On the walkway is a scientist who was previously looking at some equipment (rhino panels), but has been alerted by his colleagues. He is reaching towards a Big Red Bug Gassing button, which is connected to cylinders (which have pipes running up to the showers in the dome). That bug (and probably everyone in the room) is going to cop some poisonous gas!

- Against the wall of the diorama, there will be a bunch of hastily-assembled equipment - ammo chests, barrels, et al to give the impression of longer-term storage.

- There will be various messages painted on the wall (thought it might be fun to have a 'no accidents in _ days sign).

Anyway ... am looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Think I might be a bit ambitious - not sure if I can pull it off.

Cya,
Andrew.

This post has been edited by kajh: Jun 7 2012, 02:04 PM

[Mono]

for getting the look right try searching for Fallout 3 Laboratory images (putting the full word in got better results)

I been playing it quite a bit recently and the look of much of the interiors sounds like it fits what you want to do

[kajh]

Actually - good point - sounds perfect!

Cya,
Andrew.

[kajh]

Guys - another three questions:

1) I've not been able to get big single pieces of wood from bunnings. Where do you get yours? (I need 228mmW x 141mmD x dunno - 50-60mm high. Must be of a type that polished smooth. Will also need a
1cm high piece as the 'base base' 2cm x 2cm bigger than the big block - which I'll bevel, if I can steal
Some of Steve's time. )

2) I've got the cylinders (found a tube place in Vic which could mail me cardboard tubes of different sizes: http://www.thetubeworks.com.au/). How can I make the dome? Size I'm going with is 125mm diameter?

3) 'Gas' cylinders on the side of the silo. Best I've come up with Is plastruct grain silos - they look wrong scale. Any ideas how to make?

It's taken a lot longer to assemble the different bits that I would have thought, but ... am nearly there!


Thanks for your help.
Cya
Andrew.

This post has been edited by kajh: Jun 21 2012, 05:46 PM

[Mono]

for gas cylinders try empty CO2 cartridges

for the dome try tupperware bowls

for the basing materials possibly try a trophy maker or ask Luke Jenkins (I think that's his last name, I think he goes by EldarStorm here) as he has been doing various wooded trophy stuff for a while now.

[kajh]

Thanks Mike!

for gas cylinders try empty CO2 cartridges

From what?

for the dome try tupperware bowls

That might work. Ta!

for the basing materials possibly try a trophy maker or ask Luke Jenkins (I think that's his last name, I think he goes by EldarStorm here) as he has been doing various wooded trophy stuff for a while now.

I did try a trophy store in the city - they quoted $170. Er ... no.

I'll contact Luke.

Cya,
Andrew.

[korocite]

That is a fairly sizeable chunk of wood. I may not have a firm grasp on how this will all go together, but would you consider constructing the base to those dimensions rather than using a single block? The base could simply be a framework (think wooden picture frame) on which the base sits. The block/base itself can always be veneered if you want a specific texture.

As for the dome, I reckon a quick trip through a few $2 shops with a ruler should sort you out. They are likely to have a bowl of some sort that will work.

I still have not made it to the hobby shop at West Ryde. They may have something that will work for gas cylinders also.

Steve

[kajh]

Hi Steve!

That is a fairly sizeable chunk of wood. I may not have a firm grasp on how this will all go together, but would you consider constructing the base to those dimensions rather than using a single block? The base could simply be a framework (think wooden picture frame) on which the base sits. The block/base itself can always be veneered if you want a specific texture.

Sure - if you think that would work. I've been going for a single piece of wood simply because I thought I wouldn't be able to sort out a smooth finish.

The suggestion of a guy from bunnings was that I should be able to build it from MDF layers glued together, but I was worried about the joins. Perhaps if I make the innards out of MDF (already have a piece big enough), then ... dunno - facade with plasticard or something.

What do you think?

As for the dome, I reckon a quick trip through a few $2 shops with a ruler should sort you out. They are likely to have a bowl of some sort that will work.

Okay - will look into the Hornsby $2 stores on the weekend.

I still have not made it to the hobby shop at West Ryde. They may have something that will work for gas cylinders also.

If you see anything ... Might try the hornsby one as well.

Cya,
Andrew.