1500pts Guard List, let me know what you think Options

[EmpireGuard]

Please see New List below

HQ 405pts

Command Squad
Colonel Straken
2x Body Guards
Officer of the fleet
Medi Pack (pistol)
Vox Caster (pistol)
Krak Grenades
Carapace Armour
2x Meltas

2x Priest, shotgun and Eviserator

Elite 195pts

Marbo 65pts
Ogryn Squad 130pts

Fast Attack 55pts

Rough Riders

Heavy Support 125pts

Basilisk

Troops 720pts

Platoon Command Squad
power weapons
Metla Bomb
Voxcaster (pistol)
3x Flamer

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Krak Grenades
Vox Caster
Commissar Power weapon

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad


Platoon Command Squad
power weapons
Voxcaster (pistol)
3x Flamer

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Krak Grenades
Vox Caster
Commissar Power weapon

Infantry Squad

Infantry Squad


Heavy Weapons Squad with Auto Cannons

This post has been edited by EmpireGuard: Aug 24 2009, 09:34 AM

[EmpireGuard]

so no comments?the list is perfect?

[Drasnighta]

Bloated Straken command squad. Mobbed up units to get as much out of his rules as possible.

A whole Two Meltaguns, in the CCS.

Your ranged anti-tank Firepower consists of... One Basilisk...

Its a one-tricker, and because of that, its pretty much a yawn-fest.

I mean, you take a list like this... Why not play Orks and do it better and cheaper...?

[EmpireGuard]

Bloated Straken command squad. Mobbed up units to get as much out of his rules as possible.

Well Most of the time I will not be running just two large units unless its search and destroy. I will have it more like one large unit say 30 men to attack anything that comes close and one 10 man unit to hold the objective

Your ranged anti-tank Firepower consists of... One Basilisk...

And the Heavy Weapons Squad with Auto Cannons. I have always never had many tanks in my lists

Its a one-tricker, and because of that, its pretty much a yawn-fest.

So your suggestion would be to do what? Let me know how you would change it.

I was thinking about dropping a squad and/or a priest and using the points for something else like a sentinel or some more assault weapons. However I wanted to see what people thought of it first.

[Russel.Crowe]

Hey EmpireGuard,

In 1500pts you seem to be going for the sampler, ogryns,roughriders,priests ect now if you have a strong theme for the army or paint like a demigod then I might understand but your not using the I.G to it's full power.

*Drasnighta idea of taking orks instead is a cheap and easy way out and also a good example ''I mean, you take a list like this... Why not play Orks and do it better and cheaper...?''

-In 1500pts an ork player can fit 166 orks in a list gazgul as HQ rest in boyz and commandos ect as a I.G player I can tell you that unless you have a game winning strat by turn 2 at least youll be in c.c with the orks and lose.

Advice- Creed and Kell +inf platoon = win but if you want to use straken then make the force strong and hard hitting he has (Straken) 'COLD STEEL AND COURAGE' ok not a Order giving HQ but tough so try this rough list:

HQ-Stranken+command+banner+meltaguns+chimera.(dont have time to get in to advance strats in hq)

Troops-1 inf.platoon command and 5squads no upgrades.

-Hardened Vets 3flamers and demo upgrade 30pts ect mounted in chimera.

Elites- you can still have Marbo but no ogryns.

Fast Attack-no R.R plz unless you have a good theme or strat never use this unit.
(and now the ace in the hole)
Heavy Support-Punisher, Griffion/s

*now that short list is rough so it might have to be tweaked a lil but you have good fire power and lots of scoring units any question about this?

Russel

[Drasnighta]

And the Heavy Weapons Squad with Auto Cannons. I have always never had many tanks in my lists
So your suggestion would be to do what? Let me know how you would change it.

Anti *TANK* - not Anti-*TRANSPORT*... Trying to easily deal with Armour 13/14 Vehicles with Semi-Static Autocannons is not my idea of a good time...
Especially when theyre just sitting back, lobbing Dakka or Deff at you...

I was thinking about dropping a squad and/or a priest and using the points for something else like a sentinel or some more assault weapons. However I wanted to see what people thought of it first.

The dual-fisted approach limits you, by virtue of the fact that your obvious intention is two mobbed squads, which leaves you with a total of... One objective, perhaps two to go for... Stringing the squad out to try to get multiple objectives leaves you vulnerable to multiple charges, where your distinct lack of 3+ Armour save on your troops will leave you ground down... Plus it only takes a single charge to have you counter-assault right off the second objectives and stuck in combat until you win and try to run back, or lose.

Lets see, I'd de-bone the Command Squad... If you want to go with Straken, just leave it at Bodyguards as extras, and utilise those points for additional long ranged support weapons... Lascannons or more meltaguns... Ignore Orders, unless you REALLY need them - which this current setup doesn't... The only order you'd be trying to get regular use out of would be "Get Back in the Fight!", but your troops are already Ld9, Stubborn, with an Execution Reroll...

So, after dumping the Voxes, and the extranious stuff from the command squad(s), look at support... Your squads should either take a Heavy or Special weapon (rarely both), that way when the mission is NOT involving Kill Points, you can leave them off individuallt to advance on objectives and threaten...


You just need SOMETHING to support you as you try to win assaults against assaulty armies with Guard...

[Ashen]

I agree with OP views on this. The list just does not have the cold steel that a straken force evokes.
Start by giving some special weaps to your squads, even simple flamers would help.
More anti-tank, add some lascannons somewhere.
The rough riders just seem out of place, maybe take them out and give the ogryns a chimera to ride around in.
The basilisk just seems out of place, I would change it for a leman russ with heavy bolters all around.
Your command squad is costly, and even with straken you do not want it too close to enemy tanks, so remove the bodyguards, take away the meltas and maybe give them grenade launchers.
look for a place for some veterans, they are well worth their points.
Hope this helps.
Ashen

[EmpireGuard]

Well I have to agree with you Drasnighta. I was going to keep a few 10 man Squads out of the big unit to hold objectives but that really reduces the effectiveness of my units. Also the vox’s will not get a lot of use at least with units that need them. I think I’m still playing it at if it was a 4th ed list. Ok so I have quickly Written a new list

HQ

Command Squad
Colonel Straken
2x Body Guards
Medi Pack (pistol)
Krak Grenades
Carapace Armour
3x Meltas

1x Priest, shotgun and Eviserator

Elite

Marbo 65pts
Ogryn Squad 130pts

Fast Attack

Rough Riders

Heavy Support

Basilisk

Troops

Platoon Command Squad
power weapons
Metla Bomb
4x Flamer

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Krak Grenades
Commissar Power weapon

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad
power weapons

Infantry Squad
Power weapon

Heavy Weapons Squad with Auto Cannons

Veteran Squad
Gunner Sergeant Harker
3x Meltas

Vet Squad
3x plasma Guns
Forward Sentries

Edit:
The Flamer in the Platoon Command Squad might get swap out for grenade launchers. I still want to keep the RR because I need the speed however they really are a suicide unit the throw at the things like terminator units So they should get more than there points back as long as they don’t get shot at, I also hope to have Colonel Straken nearby so they will be I6 and Str6 on the charge. The Priest will now always go in the Infantry Squad (when I has two I was thinking about putting one in the HQ) which will always be 50 men. Gunnery Sergeant Harker will outflank most of the time. The other vet squad will hold objectives most of the time as well as the Heavy Weapons Squad.

This post has been edited by EmpireGuard: Aug 24 2009, 09:43 AM

[Russel.Crowe]

Well I have to agree with you Drasnighta. I was going to keep a few 10 man Squads out of the big unit to hold objectives but that really reduces the effectiveness of my units. Also the vox’s will not get a lot of use at least with units that need them. I think I’m still playing it at if it was a 4th ed list. Ok so I have quickly Written a new list

HQ

Command Squad
Colonel Straken
2x Body Guards
Medi Pack (pistol)
Krak Grenades
Carapace Armour
3x Meltas

1x Priest, shotgun and Eviserator

Elite

Marbo 65pts
Ogryn Squad 130pts

Fast Attack

Rough Riders

Heavy Support

Basilisk

Troops

Platoon Command Squad
power weapons
Metla Bomb
4x Flamer

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Krak Grenades
Commissar Power weapon

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad
Power weapon
Melta Bombs

Infantry Squad
power weapons

Infantry Squad
Power weapon

Heavy Weapons Squad with Auto Cannons

Veteran Squad
Gunner Sergeant Harker
3x Meltas

Vet Squad
3x plasma Guns
Forward Sentries

Edit:
The Flamer in the Platoon Command Squad might get swap out for grenade launchers. I still want to keep the RR because I need the speed however they really are a suicide unit the throw at the things like terminator units So they should get more than there points back as long as they don’t get shot at, I also hope to have Colonel Straken nearby so they will be I6 and Str6 on the charge. The Priest will now always go in the Infantry Squad (when I has two I was thinking about putting one in the HQ) which will always be 50 men. Gunnery Sergeant Harker will outflank most of the time. The other vet squad will hold objectives most of the time as well as the Heavy Weapons Squad.

Let me know how many games you can win with this list out of 10.

R.

[EmpireGuard]

Is this a question? or sarcasm? If it a question I don’t know? If it’s sarcasm well then please leave constructive criticism. I don’t mind being told my list sucks but please tell me why you think that and how you would improve it.

Ps. This is very rough (I wrote it on the train on the way to work) I am planning on doing some shuffling of a few points. Like maybe moving the Platoon Command Squads flamers into the Infantry Squad dropping the power weapon and Metla Bombs and putting in some long range fire (eg snipers and/or heavy weapons). However I wanted some thoughts on the progress of the list so far.

[Russel.Crowe]

Is this a question? or sarcasm? If it a question I don’t know? If it’s sarcasm well then please leave constructive criticism. I don’t mind being told my list sucks but please tell me why you think that and how you would improve it.

Ps. This is very rough (I wrote it on the train on the way to work) I am planning on doing some shuffling of a few points. Like maybe moving the Platoon Command Squads flamers into the Infantry Squad dropping the power weapon and Metla Bombs and putting in some long range fire (eg snipers and/or heavy weapons). However I wanted some thoughts on the progress of the list so far.

EmpireGuard, I would never hop on someones post and waste my time with sarcastic comments and on that note 'yes' it is a question I didn't think it needed more but so we're clear on the matter best out of 10 games is how I measure how well an army preforms under pressure so 'NO' your army dose not suck I just want to give you advice like anyone else on WGAU and I already posted on here what I think is needed but like most of us(gamers) you will want to stick to your guns so all I'm asking is how many games with this list out of 10 can you win? if the answer is 8,6 or even 5 then your list is ok is all I'm saying.

Cheer mate R.

[EmpireGuard]

Cool No problem I find it hard to measure tone on posts and I haven’t seen you on the forums before. Well till I test it will have no idea as I took a year off and so aren’t sure what people are using now days. However if I had to pick a number I would say 7 as 32 power weapon attacks should hurt a lot of MEQ armies. And they are as always in the majority.

The thing I would struggle with are Horde as then a power weapons don’t help a lot when the saves are only 5+ 6+ anyway.

Massed (especially mobile) fire power. This is part of the reason for the RR as they have krak genades and can move 19-24” on the charge. However if a lot of their fire power is High strength and AP rather than hire fire rate then I think I can do ok. Heavy bolters and the like will be my down fall.

I think that about the only ones I will have trouble with. Really I will lose combat alot but my main aim is to kill more point’s worth than more men. Yes I might lose 15 men on combat but only kill 8 but 8 marines are worth more than 15 guardsmen and I will be unlikely to run due to LD 9 stubborn with rerolls.

[Russel.Crowe]

Cool No problem I find it hard to measure tone on posts and I haven’t seen you on the forums before. Well till I test it will have no idea as I took a year off and so aren’t sure what people are using now days. However if I had to pick a number I would say 7 as 32 power weapon attacks should hurt a lot of MEQ armies. And they are as always in the majority.

The thing I would struggle with are Horde as then a power weapons don’t help a lot when the saves are only 5+ 6+ anyway.

Massed (especially mobile) fire power. This is part of the reason for the RR as they have krak genades and can move 19-24” on the charge. However if a lot of their fire power is High strength and AP rather than hire fire rate then I think I can do ok. Heavy bolters and the like will be my down fall.

I think that about the only ones I will have trouble with. Really I will lose combat alot but my main aim is to kill more point’s worth than more men. Yes I might lose 15 men on combat but only kill 8 but 8 marines are worth more than 15 guardsmen and I will be unlikely to run due to LD 9 stubborn with rerolls.

Oh I've been around and it's all good. Rough Riders for me where the one trick pony of bs fun yes there s**t but when 30 of them charge the enemys most expensive unit and smash it always gets a lol.
But any hoo comp will always be the issue at good tournaments all ways allusive for me as I make fun lists.

You must battle under different conditions all the time to find your armys weak points I find btw where do you live? plz don't say townsville

R.

[EmpireGuard]

I live in reservoir.

I don't play that often but have been playing warhammer for about 8-9 years so it adds up. I have also been playing strategy games my whole life as far back as I remember.

[Russel.Crowe]

I live in reservoir.

I don't play that often but have been playing warhammer for about 8-9 years so it adds up. I have also been playing strategy games my whole life as far back as I remember.

I'm in Geelong.

I work nightfill full time so gaming is to few and far between. I'm now going to but Straken and smash out as many 1500pts using your list to see what I can come up with.

R.