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> ATC 2015, Player Pack, Detachment Restrictions and more
difsta
post Oct 29 2014, 09:46 AM
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The ATC Website can be found at australasianteamchallenge.com

You can also check us out on Facebook

Your Committee Members:
WA - Mike Basc
SA - Tom Damin
VIC - Joshua Diffey
TAS - Aaron Bradley
NSW - Jason Collins
ACT - Dale Garland
QLD - Danny Whitehead
NZ - Haydn Korach

You can find the latest Player Pack here. It will contain everything you need to know about the ATC, including the venue which is in Hobart in 2015.

Just so people are on the same page here, Page 7 of the player pack discusses the Army List restrictions as of Version 17 12/03/2015:
QUOTE
Army lists

• Army lists are to be 1850 points and consist of a Battle-Forged Army as per page 559 of the 7th Edition Warhammer 40,000 Rule Book.
• Army lists from all teams are due by Friday the 5th of June at 23:59 and should be in Word format using the provided sample. See Army List Submission below.
• All Games Workshop Codeces, Data Slate – Formations and Data Slate – Army List Entries released before Monday the 5th of May at 23:59 2015 will be in use. Remembering that a Formation will take up a Faction slot (For example the Fallen Champions Formation from the Cypher Dataslate has the Chaos Space Marines Faction, as such if used as a Non Primary Detachment then the Chaos Space Marines, Black Legion, Crimson Slaughter, etc. Codeces/Supplements cannot be used as a Non Primary Detachment in this army or any other army for a team)
• Formations and Army List Entries from additional sources such as a campaign book will not automatically be included. On a case by case basis they may be included, please seek approval prior to submitting an army list.
• Imperial armour is NOT allowed.
• Escalation will not be in use
• Stronghold Assault will be in use with the exception of any buildings with the Mighty Bulwark Special Rule (eg. the Macro-Cannon or Vortex Missile Aquila Strongpoint) and all Fortification Networks (eg. The Void Relay Network).

• Each Army may have a total of 3 Detachments. Please refer to Appendix 1 at the end of this document for the Current Detachment types.
• Each Army may have only 1 “Large” Detachment
• Each Army may have only 1 Allied Detachment
• Each Army may have only 1 “Small” Detachment
• A Faction (as per page 561) can be used once as a Primary Detachment (as per page 560) and once as a Non Primary Detachment.
• No 2 Armies can share the same 2+ Factions as any other Army in their team.
• Any unit labelled as a Unique unit, eg. Mephiston, Eldrad, etc. may be used only once in a team.
• Lords of War of all varieties will be treated as having the Unique Special Rule. This means only 1 player may use a Stompa for example as Unique units are one use per team.
• Each player regardless of detachment types may only have 1 unit with the Lord of War battlefield role. For example a player taking a CAD of necrons and a Living Tomb Necron formation may not use the Lord of War slot in their CAD as they have already used their maximum 1 Lord of War in the Living Tomb Formation.


And here is Appendix 1 which is on page 13:
QUOTE
Appendix 1: Detachment Types

As new Codeces, Data Slates, Campaign Books and White Dwarf codex entries/formations are published, this Appendix will be updated. Please keep an eye on this document and make sure you have the latest version.

Large Detachments:
- Combined Arms Detachment
- Nemesis Strike Force (Grey Knight Codex)
- Great Waaagh! Detachment (Waaagh! Gazghkull Supplement)
- Company of the Great Wolf (Champions of Fenris Supplement)
- Realspace Raiders Detachment (Dark Eldar Codex)
- Covenite Coterie Detachment (Haemonculus Covens Supplement)
- Imperial Knight Detachment of 3 Imperial Knights (Imperial Knights)
- Hive Fleet Detachment (Shield of Baal: Leviathan)
- Baal Strike Force (Blood Angels Codex)
- Archangels Strike Force (Shield of Baal: Exterminatus)
- Flesh Tearers Strike Force (Shield of Baal: Exterminatus)
- Mephrit Dynasty Cohort (Shield of Baal: Exterminatus)
- Necron Decurion Detachment (Necron Codex) – Remember Lord of War limits
- Harlequin Masque Detachment (Harlequin Codex)


Medium Detachments:
- Allied Detachment

Small Detachments:
- Imperial Knight Detachment of less than 3 Imperial Knights
- Assassins Detachment
- Legion of the Damned Detachment
- Inquisitorial Detachment
- All Formations listed in a Codex
- All Formations from Data Slates, they can be found here: http://www.blacklibrary.com/games-workshop...ions/Dataslates
- Formation from the listed Campaign Books/White Dwarfs.
o Astra Militarum: Sanctus Reach Red Waagh (The Steel Host, Rampart Detachment)
o Blood Angels: Shield of Baal: Exterminatus (Archangels Orbital Intervention Force, Archangels Sanguine Wing, Archangels Demi-Company, The Archangels, Blooded Demi-Company, Strike Force Mortalis, Dante’s Avenging Host, Flesh Tearers Vanguard Strike Force, Lysios Relief Force, The Defenders of the Cathedrum, Strike Force Razorwind), Shield of Baal: Deathstorm (Strike Force Deathstorm), White Dwarf 47 (Angel’s Wrath Intervention Force, Angel’s Fury Spearhead Force, Flesh Tearers Blood Rain Strike Force)
o Dark Angels: Black Library Advent Calendar Datasheet (Dark Angels Librarius Conclave)
o Imperial Knights: Sanctus Reach Red Whaagh (Adamantine Lance)
o Necrons: Shield of Baal: Exterminatus (Conclave of the Burning One, Zarathusa’s Royal Decurion, Anrakyr’s Strategic Decurion, The Guardians of Perdita, White Dwarf 47 (Mephrit Dynasty Resurgence Decurion)
o Orks: Sanctus Reach Red Whaagh (Gorkanaut Krushin' Krew, Mogrok's Bossboyz), Sanctus Reach: Stormclaw (Grukk's Rippin' Krew), Sanctus Reach: Hour of the Wolf (Skyboss Wingnutz Air Armada, Grukk's Goff Killermob, Kaptin Badrukk's Flash Gitz)
o Space Wolves: Sanctus Reach: Stormclaw (The Fierce-Eye's Finest), Sanctus Reach: Hour of the Wolf (Wolfguard Strike Force, Grimnar's Kingsguard, Ragnar's Claws)
o Tyranids: Shield of Baal: Leviathan (Skytyrant Swarm, Sporefield, Neural Node, Skytide), Shield of Baal: Exterminatus (Hypertoxic Node, Skyblight Swarm, Sporefield, Shield of Baal: Deathstorm (Phodian Annihilation Swarm)


and while I am at it here is appendix 2 on page 14 smile.gif
QUOTE
Appendix 2: Army Entry Datasheets

As new Army Entry Datasheets are published, whether that be in Data Slates, White Dwarf articles, Campaigns books, or any other format they will be added to this appendix.

- Cypher, the Fallen Angel (Cypher dataslate)
- Be'lakor (Be'lakor dataslate)
- Gerantius, the Forgotten Knight (White Dwarf)
- Grukk Facerippa (Sanctus Reach: the Red Waaagh!)
- Looted Wagon (White Dwarf)
- Tyrannic War Veterans (Tyrannic War Veterans dataslate)
- Krom Dragongaze (Sanctus Reach: the Red Waaagh!)
- Tyrannocyte, Sporocyst, Mucolid Spore (WD/Shield of Baal:Deathstorm)
- Toxicrene, Maleceptor (WD/Black library site/Shield of Baal:Deathstorm)
- Spawn of Cryptus , Children of Cryptus (Shield of Baal: Deathstorm)
- Blood Angels: Captain Karlaen (Shield Of Baal: Deathstorm)


This post has been edited by difsta: Mar 12 2015, 02:33 PM


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difsta
post Nov 19 2014, 02:43 PM
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sorry for the delay on this one. The Player Pack has been updated over on the Australasian Team Challenge website.

This includes the latest changes to the detachment restrictions.


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ThatWallyGuy
post Dec 11 2014, 10:59 AM
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Quick question about the formation restrictions..

Now as a nid player we have access to several formation options the vast majority being small ones and seem to be designed to work togeather. Allies do not really work well for Nids (while can take them.. getting close can pose a issue)

I myself have a habit of running 3 formations for my nids and will likely run 3 for ACT masters early in the new year.. For example I will likely have Skyrantswarm, Endless Swarm and a Combined arms (may swap out Combinded arms for a diffrent Nid Formation depending on the list I finally chose to run with)


Now with your format
Each Army may have a total of 3 Detachments
 Each Army may have only 1 “Large” Detachment (Combined Arms
Detachment or Codex specific Detachments, eg. Nemesis Strikeforce)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Medium” Detachment (Allied Detachments)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Small” Detachment (Formations, Imperial
Knight Detachment, Assassins Detachment, Legion of the Damned
Detachment, and Inquisitorial Detachment)

Would I be able to field such a list with Combined Arms as the 'Large' Endless Swarm as the 'Medium' and Skyrant Swarm as the 'Small'

This post has been edited by ThatWallyGuy: Dec 11 2014, 10:59 AM


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difsta
post Dec 11 2014, 11:42 AM
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expect an update to this for more detailed descriptions of each detachment. But in a nut shell the only thing allowed currently (and in the foreseeable future) in the medium slot is an allied detachment. So there is no way of running 3 detachments of the same faction because the allied detachment cannot have the same faction as the primary detachment.
If you wish to have your point of view argued, speak to your Canberra ATC rep and get him to debate your point to the committee.


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Æon
post Dec 11 2014, 11:46 AM
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So I presume the update by the 14th of November is for 2015? tongue.gif

This post has been edited by ĆON: Dec 11 2014, 11:46 AM


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barit
post Dec 11 2014, 12:29 PM
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QUOTE(difsta @ Dec 11 2014, 12:12 PM) *

expect an update to this for more detailed descriptions of each detachment. But in a nut shell the only thing allowed currently (and in the foreseeable future) in the medium slot is an allied detachment. So there is no way of running 3 detachments of the same faction because the allied detachment cannot have the same faction as the primary detachment.
If you wish to have your point of view argued, speak to your Canberra ATC rep and get him to debate your point to the committee.


Wait what, you are classifying a formation or detachment as an ally? So we can all look forward to playing the same 5 lists from each team over and over!

Seer Council
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Cent Star
Lance + crap
Knights + crap

Why not just stick with the 2 uses of a codex max and single named characters? All you are doing is forcing the teams into the same horrible to play against mono builds. If you really want to have a hard cap on the all the crap the game can do now why not just give each team an arbitrary number of Community Comp points to spend?

This post has been edited by barit: Dec 11 2014, 12:58 PM


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difsta
post Dec 11 2014, 01:02 PM
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QUOTE(barit @ Dec 11 2014, 01:29 PM) *

Wait what, you are classifying a formation or detachment as an ally? So we can all look forward to playing the same 5 lists from each team over and over!

Seer Council
Summoning spam
Cent Star
Lance + crap
Knights + crap

Why not just stick with the 2 uses of a codex max and single named characters? All you are doing is forcing the teams into the same horrible to play against mono builds.


not sure if I was clear on that one or not. But as per the player pack now (all the new player pack is help define some of the detachments into the already fairly clear categories) you can take 1 large detachment (CAD or codex specific detachment, eg. nemesis strike force, company of the great wolf, etc.) 1 medium detachment (allied detachment) 1 small detachment (formations, inquisition fall under this and not large, legion of the damned fall under this and not large, assassins, and a couple of others).

You can only use a faction (not codex, but faction) twice, once as a primary and once as a non primary. no 2 armies can share 2 or more factions.

So here is an example of a legal army that would use both Tau slots in your team
QUOTE
Large Detachment: CAD of Tau (Primary Detachment)
Medium Detachment: Allied of Eldar
Small Detachment: Fire Cadre Formation


here is an example of an ILLEGAL army at the ATC as Tau can only be used once as a primary and once as a non primary, and this uses Tau twice as a non primary.
QUOTE
Large Detachment: CAD of Tau
Medium Detachment: Allied of Tau
Small Detachment: Inquisition (Primary Detachment)


Another example of an ILLEGAL army at the ATC due to formations taking up a small detachment, and only allowing one small detachment.
QUOTE
Detachment 1: Adamantium Lance Formation
Detachment 2: Inquisition Detachment (Primary Detachment)


I hope this helps clarify some of the restrictions. This has been discussed at length with the ATC committee. We are still looking at making some minor wording changes to allow a couple of armies which aren't currently allowed in the current restrictions that we think should be able to.

If you have any constructive feedback, I would suggest having a chat in person with your ATC rep. Also it is a lot easier to get your point across if you offer a solution rather than a problem. If you disagree with a point, then offer a suggested solution and we can discuss it smile.gif


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Æon
post Dec 11 2014, 01:09 PM
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QUOTE(difsta @ Dec 11 2014, 02:02 PM) *

not sure if I was clear on that one or not. But as per the player pack now (all the new player pack is help define some of the detachments into the already fairly clear categories) you can take 1 large detachment (CAD or codex specific detachment, eg. nemesis strike force, company of the great wolf, etc.) 1 medium detachment (allied detachment) 1 small detachment (formations, inquisition fall under this and not large, legion of the damned fall under this and not large, assassins, and a couple of others).

You can only use a faction (not codex, but faction) twice, once as a primary and once as a non primary. no 2 armies can share 2 or more factions.


Out of curiosity; once the wording is finalised, its RAW when it comes to determining if a list is legal, correct?

BTW, when does it get finalised?

I can already see an issue, but I really don't want to mention it as it will get clarified (ACT will have a trick up its sleeve for once - wooo! tongue.gif)


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difsta
post Dec 11 2014, 01:24 PM
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QUOTE(ĆON @ Dec 11 2014, 02:09 PM) *

Out of curiosity; once the wording is finalised, its RAW when it comes to determining if a list is legal, correct?

BTW, when does it get finalised?

I can already see an issue, but I really don't want to mention it as it will get clarified (ACT will have a trick up its sleeve for once - wooo! tongue.gif)


honestly, some committee members like me don't have a life, and so I respond to questions/votes pretty quickly. Others don't spend every minute watching facebook (slackers tongue.gif ). So the wording is almost finalised, the only thing that will change is as new types of detachments come out, and new campaign books, they will get added to an appendix in the player pack to state which category they fall in. The goal is to state which detachments/formations/etc. fall under which detachment type rather than simply state things like "Codex specific detachments".

As for you can already see an issue, once the latest pack is out, ideally if you can see an issue you should bring it up with your committee member, the goal out of the latest version of the player pack (hopefully out in the next day or so) is to clear up any holes. But as for a "final" version. I would say that the ATC committee who is represented by every state can update the player pack at any point, but I would hope that there wouldn't be too many more changes. And I would hope that once lists are submitted there wouldn't be any more changes tongue.gif but that being said, we are around 6 months out from the event, the player pack is likely to have updates a number of times between now and then as new things come out and break the current pack.

It is the earliest we have probably had the player pack out, so if you think you are being dodgy, then I would recommend not building the army just yet, cause it is likely we will find the hole eventually.

don't be that guy...


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ThatWallyGuy
post Dec 11 2014, 01:53 PM
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Oh okay.. maybe you should rename the detachment Categories..


because to me the ones in brackets seem to be more of a suggestion then the done deal.. Also might help clarify what counts as a Large, medium (apparently only allies are medium) and small detachments


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post Dec 11 2014, 02:02 PM
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QUOTE(ThatWallyGuy @ Dec 11 2014, 02:53 PM) *

Oh okay.. maybe you should rename the detachment Categories..
because to me the ones in brackets seem to be more of a suggestion then the done deal.. Also might help clarify what counts as a Large, medium (apparently only allies are medium) and small detachments


We are ahead of you on that. We ate putting together a definitive list of what is considered what and what is allowed.
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difsta
post Dec 12 2014, 08:29 AM
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player pack has been updated on the ATC website, check out the link in the top post


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ThatWallyGuy
post Dec 12 2014, 11:00 AM
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QUOTE(difsta @ Dec 12 2014, 09:29 AM) *

player pack has been updated on the ATC website, check out the link in the top post


What has changed?


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difsta
post Dec 12 2014, 11:19 AM
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QUOTE(ThatWallyGuy @ Dec 12 2014, 12:00 PM) *

What has changed?


have you read it? The main thing is check out the appendix section which describes what falls under Large, Medium and Small detachments


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ThatWallyGuy
post Dec 12 2014, 11:31 AM
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QUOTE(difsta @ Dec 12 2014, 12:19 PM) *

have you read it? The main thing is check out the appendix section which describes what falls under Large, Medium and Small detachments


looks to be the same wording as before.. maybe the link isn't correct


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ThatWallyGuy
post Dec 12 2014, 11:36 AM
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No wait I see the difference now..

Each Army may have a total of 3 Detachments
 Each Army may have only 1 “Large” Detachment (Combined Arms
Detachment or Codex specific Detachments, eg. Nemesis Strikeforce)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Medium” Detachment (Allied Detachments)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Small” Detachment (Formations, Imperial
Knight Detachment, Assassins Detachment, Legion of the Damned
Detachment, and Inquisitorial Detachment)


So my new questions with this..

So the 'Large' one can only be a CAD or one from your parent Codex? what about the races who havent received a 7th ed codex, so don't have a codex formation?

'Medium' really my thing here is why Call it Medium when it is only Allied detachment that can be taken?

So looking at this layout playing Tyranids you are restricted to just the CAD and a single formation?

This seems mega restrictive in general..

This post has been edited by ThatWallyGuy: Dec 12 2014, 11:37 AM


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difsta
post Dec 12 2014, 12:21 PM
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QUOTE(ThatWallyGuy @ Dec 12 2014, 12:36 PM) *

So the 'Large' one can only be a CAD or one from your parent Codex? what about the races who havent received a 7th ed codex, so don't have a codex formation?

'Medium' really my thing here is why Call it Medium when it is only Allied detachment that can be taken?

So looking at this layout playing Tyranids you are restricted to just the CAD and a single formation?

This seems mega restrictive in general..


what about codeces that haven't received a 7th ed codex? They can still take a CAD or they can take an allied detachment... I am not sure what you are asking here. If they don't have a formation then the best you can take is a CAD or an allied detachment of that faction. I am not sure what you are after here.

if you want to play any army with no other factions then yes you can take a CAD or a single formation. Not all armies even have formations yet. Tyranids are far from restricted.

You do realize that in 7th edition you can take allies right...

ATC is about the attempt at having 8 different lists, 6th edition made that a little harder, and 7th even more. We have put in restrictions on the number of detachments and the number of times a faction can be taken to stick to that ethos.

I know that in Vics team selection we have 2 very strong nid players, and there lists are BS good, I am not sure how you think they are being hard done by. I mean the 3 HQ detachment is sick!


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difsta
post Dec 12 2014, 12:37 PM
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QUOTE(ThatWallyGuy @ Dec 12 2014, 12:36 PM) *

No wait I see the difference now..

Each Army may have a total of 3 Detachments
 Each Army may have only 1 “Large” Detachment (Combined Arms
Detachment or Codex specific Detachments, eg. Nemesis Strikeforce)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Medium” Detachment (Allied Detachments)
 Each Army may have only 1 “Small” Detachment (Formations, Imperial
Knight Detachment, Assassins Detachment, Legion of the Damned
Detachment, and Inquisitorial Detachment)

your copy and paste seems from an old document... see the original post at the top


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post Dec 12 2014, 01:03 PM
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The Leviathan Rising supplement isnt allowed? Any reasons as to why?


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post Dec 12 2014, 01:10 PM
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QUOTE(difsta @ Dec 12 2014, 01:37 PM) *

your copy and paste seems from an old document... see the original post at the top


That was taken from the top link....


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