New Daemons, Value? Options

[Shadow Fox]

New Daemon Models are up for pre-order.

I don't really see the value here.
+ The chariot model is nice but the rules for slaanesh chariots aren't great, nor is having a new armor 11 vehicle in a infantry army.
+ The nurglings are nice, but the sculpt is too easily duplicated through green stuff. Also once again they are in far too small a quantity; especially now that you can't even divide the nurglings up into more bases.
+ Screamers look good, but price for what's essentially detailing on a cookie cut out.
+ Blue scribes are a interesting model. Yet the price is a bit high and in game T3 W2 IC models aren't all that reliable.
+ The real winner here are the plague bearers. They're finally plastic and highly detailed.
+ Also flamers got a update on their flame effects... (Again, really simple sculpt)

Edit - From "What's new Today":

The rules for all of these new units in both Warhammer and Warhammer 40,000 will be be available in a handy Daemon-filled booklet that comes with August's issue of White Dwarf, so when you place your order for your new sets don't forget to include a copy of White Dwarf if you're not already a subscriber.

Also they play a game of daemons against eldar in the white dwarf article and from what's shown the daemon player basically loses turn one.

This post has been edited by Shadow Fox: Jul 28 2012, 06:21 PM

[Starfire]

From a playing perspective, they won't be worth buying until they have a codex which isn't complete garbage.

From a painting and modelling perspective, they look pretty cool.

[Bane]

i think the metal plagues look much better

just like the metal daemonettes looked much better

and the metal bloodletters looked much better.

I really dont like how tall the nurgling models are, what is this? Some new direction for swarms that has them standing as tall as a space marine? Leads to LOS complications and future acusations of modelling for advantage to players with old nurgling models.

All up I am dissapointed, and a white dwarf rules update?

Allowing the soul grinder in fantasy wont help the fact that people hate playing demons

Adding a av11 vehicle in 40k that wont ever be used wont help that the army is pants and 6th ed didnt help.

[Bryony]

Wow the GW site is running slow today.

From a looks only perspective (as I'm not privy to the new codex);

I like the previous flamers better than these new ones.
The chariots look awesome.
The plaguebearers are kind of meh.
Love the nurglings.
Screamers, meh.
Blue scribe, not sure if I like it.

I hope the new codex is good. I bought a few chaos daemons a while ago just because they were cool models, it'd be nice to fill it out into an army that is fun to play.

[Retribution Shot]

I love most of these new models

flamers are models are more awesome then before and cheaper
chairots are ok wouldn't buy them over other stuff though
love that bearer are now plastic decent models
nurglings are to high so dont really like them
blue scribes are intersting
great unclean one pretty cool

[bob sprocket]

Finally, a Blue scribes. He was a great choice in 5th, now in 6th, I think he's meh compared to another flying MC with a 3+ inv (in a Bird of Change). And at $61 for a resin model thats not big, they can jam that one up their a$$.

PBs are more zombie than daemon. Nurglings look worse and worse everytime I see that. Glad I've stockpiled mine (got 28+ bases). Flamers are a minor step down I think. I don't like hte little scuplted flames. The daemon isn't on fire, it just shoots fire. Screamers are ok. I think I'll mix them in with my current metals. Esp since they now look like they're good.

[Paraelix]

great unclean one pretty cool

This model has not changed =/

[ormo]

I think I'm easy to please. I really like the look of all the new models. Especially the Slaanesh chariot. That things awesome!

[Bane]

woudlnt you love to paint that only to have it die every right after it deep stikes onto the table

[ormo]

woudlnt you love to paint that only to have it die every right after it deep stikes onto the table

Thats my problem with all my armies. I paint them and they all die horribly on the table top

[Marshal_Loss]

Don't like the plaguebearers, the Slaaneshi models are pretty cool though. Tempted to pick up a resin Fateweaver...

EDIT: Those 4D6 impact hits are bloody insane

This post has been edited by Marshal_Loss: Jul 28 2012, 02:38 PM

[EzekielBrodie]

Flamers are faster (jump pack) and cheaper (23 down from 35), though lost the 4+ so will die more.
Screamers are worse (their meltabombs nerfed from St8 to st5) and more expensive (25 up from 16). GW continues to be retarded; nerf something and increase its points cost. Great. Don't even talk to me about them being AP2 in cc, pretty sure you'll just get boltered to death before you get anywhere near that nice juicy terminator squad you think you can kill.
Hellflayer chariot is meh. Cheap but its not like daemons need another fast assault unit.
Seeker chariot: Cheap and 2 HPs mean this thing hates everything bigger than a bolter. Fortunately spammable in squadrons of 3 might give it some value.
Exalted seeker chariot. Not bad having 4 HPs for only 90pts. You could potentially spam these with Slaanesh Heralds as well, which will be nice with multiple Pavanes. That said, they're still more of the same close combat crap that puts daemons behind the 8 ball. OLD AS TIME ITSELF BUT CAN'T INVENT GUNS WTF!!!
It is worth noting that Daemon princes are still badass flyers and aren't slouches in cc so I don't see chariots replacing princes in the HS slot unfortunately.

Overall impression is that it won't do anything to bring daemons up off the bottom of the 40k ladder. We'll wait and see what shenanigans can be pulled with the CSM codex I guess.

[Magos_Kasen]

Chariots are ######
Plaguebearers are ok, not better but at least cheaper.
Nurglings look crap.
Flamers look worse than current
Screamers are good, not better, but not really worse.

And the soulgrinder is still horribly ugly.

Disappointing.

[Turkish]

Considering that both Flamers and screamers got an extra wound and bumped up to I4 then I don't see that they were nerfed. Sure Screamers lost meltabombs but now they are more versatile having 3 attacks on the charge at str 5 ap 2 against more than just vehicles and MC's also they still get 2dg armour pen.

Exhalted chariots look interesting, maybe not competative but they certainly look fun.

[Zidi]

Considering that both Flamers and screamers got an extra wound and bumped up to I4 then I don't see that they were nerfed. Sure Screamers lost meltabombs but now they are more versatile having 3 attacks on the charge at str 5 ap 2 against more than just vehicles and MC's also they still get 2dg armour pen.

Exhalted chariots look interesting, maybe not competative but they certainly look fun.

I need to get this white dwarf

Have to wait for CSM codex but like the flamer and screamers, could be good little ally force. Jump Pack Chaos lord running some screamers could be fun.

Tzeetch here i come

This post has been edited by Zidi: Jul 28 2012, 06:18 PM

[ÆON]

Flamers are faster (jump pack) and cheaper (23 down from 35), though lost the 4+ so will die more.
Screamers are worse (their meltabombs nerfed from St8 to st5) and more expensive (25 up from 16). GW continues to be retarded; nerf something and increase its points cost. Great. Don't even talk to me about them being AP2 in cc, pretty sure you'll just get boltered to death before you get anywhere near that nice juicy terminator squad you think you can kill.

Brodie, Both Flamers and Screamers now have 2 wounds each so I doubt they will die more; Screamers have gone from 1 attack to 3 attacks base so Im fairly sure Id rather them with that rather than one attack base.

The 4++ loss was I think a oversight as thats Tzeentchs thing and Ill be suprised it doesnt make it into the FAQ.

I think you either misread the profile and didnt see the changes or just like the kneejerk complaining because all the cool kids are doing it

[EzekielBrodie]

Brodie, Both Flamers and Screamers now have 2 wounds each so I doubt they will die more; Screamers have gone from 1 attack to 3 attacks base so Im fairly sure Id rather them with that rather than one attack base.

The 4++ loss was I think a oversight as thats Tzeentchs thing and Ill be suprised it doesnt make it into the FAQ.

I think you either misread the profile and didnt see the changes or just like the kneejerk complaining because all the cool kids are doing it

I have seen the changes and stand by my intial comments. There is no ambiguity about losing the 4++ as far as I can see so they would essentially have to rewrite the article again to bring it back. Moreover, I fail to see how you think 25pts for a T4, 2W, 5+ save dude with no shooting attacks is possibly going to be a good buy. When you're scared by rapid firing bolters and lasguns and can only have any impact in close combat, you probably need to be under 15-20pts to be efficient. AP2 melee means diddly when you can't make combat reliably. This is the root cause of the Daemon problem afterall; units that are solely useful in close combat, fragile, and expensive are rife throughout the codex, and it is the last thing you need in a game so focused around shooting. What they *needed* was a chariot with freaking meltaguns or autocannon or something similar, not one that dies to heavy bolters and only has scythes.

Flamers I said in my first post have gotten better and cheaper, so no arguments there. If CSM can bring some scouting icons or something to the table in the new dex then DSing flamers in close might be fun.

[Shadow Fox]

I don't have the white dwarf book yet but why on page 34 does it say that Warpfire is as strong as a Heavy bolter? Has it been buffed? Have Heavy Bolters been Nerfed?

[ÆON]

Moreover, I fail to see how you think 25pts for a T4, 2W, 5+ save dude with no shooting attacks is possibly going to be a good buy. When you're scared by rapid firing bolters and lasguns and can only have any impact in close combat,

See; its comments like these makes me think that you aren't looking at the unit close enough. It has a slash attack that it can hit a unit it passed over; D3 S4 per screamer that can be useful when getting the screamers into range. That may not be much to you; but I think thats fairly decent. Daemons have always been lacking in fast moving units and the Screamers add something that few units can actually do; mobile while doing damage, AP2, take out vehicles and can take abit of punishment. 2 Wounds a piece and a 4+ Cover till you want to get into combat makes them decent IMHO

[Ryorus]

I don't have the white dwarf book yet but why on page 34 does it say that Warpfire is as strong as a Heavy bolter? Has it been buffed? Have Heavy Bolters been Nerfed?

lol, no change shadow, just trying to talk them up.