Howdy,

I was wondering if anyone here has had alot of experience with Airbrushing? I was wondering about a few things, so I thought I'd ask around before making a fool of myself.

1) Watering-down GW and Vallejo paints - how do I do it so it runs smoothly out of an airbrush? Do I use water or an arcrilic thinner? Or do I use neither?

2) Detail work - does anyone have an how-to on creating basic colours and patterns (Camo, etc)?

3) Steadying the hand - Is it just like painting or is there less/more 'shakes'?

4) Good aircompessors - Brands, where to buy, etc.

5) Using varnishes through the Airbrush. Yay or Nay? Is it better to get a can of Testors Dullcote instead?

6) Paints that run smoothly through Airbrushes?

7) A good PSI (I heard 30 is a good number) for work with minatures.

Thanks for all the help, and hopefully this clears the backlog of unpainted miniatures

Don't know much about airbrushing, but apparently Derivan minis are good for airbrushing. know that Tamiya paints are specifically made with airbrushing in mind.

Enamel + Airbrushing = pain in the arse to clean your airbrush

Thanks guys for the replies.

BWS - Tamiya, thats the name of the company. Do you know how GW or Vallejo would work?

RB - alright, so I am looking for water-based paints to airbrush with only. Cheers mate

GW paints work I usually just water them down or use some tamiya paint thinner. I have even used boltgun metal through a cheap airbrush, don't try it through a fine detail airbrush though. tamiya paint I don't thin I find they are fine as is. I have never done any detail work with mine I just use it for undercoats and base coats.

1) You can use just straight water for water based paints. But instead I mix windex into the paint, till its about as thick as blood.

2) Havent a how to, do a google search you should find a heap of answers to your quesitons.

3) Having a steady hand helps when doing fine spraying, like shading or highlighting, but for just doing straight base coats a steady hand isn't always need.

4) Any air compressor will do the job, you can get small ones designed just for airbrushing, you will be looking at around $200-$500 for one of them. I use a cheap air compressor from super cheap, 80 bucks, bit noisy when the tanks refils, but you get used to it.

5) Nay, very very messy to clean. Just get a can of dullcoat.

6) Valejo runs very nicely.

7) PSI depends of the thickness of the paint and etc, 30 is good, but play around with it until you find the PSI level you like.

Hope that helps!

(1) I've found GW paint needs to be thinned with water. Alcohol makes it clog the airbrush. Conversely, Tamiya acrylics need to be thinned with alcohol in order to spray well. "Thin to the consistency of milk", is the general rule here.

(2) Basically, if you're doing camo, start with an undercoat of the light colour and do the darker shades over the top. If the light colour is only going to be used in small blotches, you can do it over the dark. It's generally pretty straightforward.

(3) I've not found "the shakes" to be an issue. It's totally different to brush painting, and you don't generally work with fine detail using an airbrush, so unless you have a serious caffeine twitch happening it shouldn't cause any grief. Basically, if you can paint reasonably neatly with a brush, an airbrush will not cause any problems.

(4) The compressor you get will need to be a regulated, continuous-flow type, capable of dialling the pressure to 15-30 psi. A moisture trap is a nice optional extra, but is not essential if you're only spraying water-based paints. Most 100-buck compressors with a tank available from Bunnings are fine, albeit noisy, so you'll want to do your spraying outdoors . I have a 21 litre tank capacity on my GMC cheapie, and I just charge the tank up and spray from that.

Make sure you can get an adaptor to hook your airbrush to the compressor. Most arts stores have a range of suitable fittings, and indeed Bunnings or similar may carry the fittings you need.

In lieu of using a big "industrial" compressor, you can get small desktop hobby compressors which are damn near silent. I have not seen these for less than $250, and most with integral air tanks are significantly more. If you are serious about airbrushing, they're worth getting, but if you're just starting out they are not essential.

(5) I'm loath to run varnishes through an airbrush. In retrospect, I suspect maybe my mix was wrong, but I have found that excessive frosting of varnish occurred when airbrushing. The cans of varnish, IMO, are fine.

(6) Most model paints, once thinned, are fine. Vallejo, GW and Derivan are all supposed to be fine thinned with water. Tamiya paints need to use special alcohol-based thinners.

(7) Varies between paints and airbrushes. Gravity-fed airbrushes work well at as little as 9 psi, but 15-22 is generally the standard. Suction-fed models (most of the cheapie airbrushes fit into this category) usually work fine from 20-25 psi.

Look on the the GW Blakc Gobbo site for an article called 'tread heads' or something similar, it shows the basics of airbrushing technquies and stuff.

Cheers
Dave

I use Gunze-Sangyo Aqueous Hobby Colour (a.k.a. "Mr Hobby") acrylic paints through my airbrush. They are designed with airbrushing in mind and are absolutely excellent - I would recommend them to anyone for this purpose! Mix them with the correct thinner of the same brand name to the consistency of milk, and you'll get a smooth finish every time! I would not recommend GW paints for airbrushing. They are not really meant for this purpose - they are comparitively thick paints designed for comparitively thick brush-applied layers. Gunze-Sangyo and Tamiya are both very good for airbrushing, and Vallejo Military Colours, Vallejo Game Colours, and Reaper Master Series will all give good results as well.

If you have an airbrush, stop using spraycans for your undercoating! Use Gunze-Sangyo Flat White over Gunze-Sangyo Flat Black through your airbrush, and you'll get a dead-smooth, first class undercoat every time! In terms of sealing, I use several coats of Gunze-Sangyo Flat-Matt Topcoat from an ordinary spraycan over a coat of gloss. :-D

With regard to steadying the hand: One thing that many people who experience the "shakes" when painting seem to have in common is that they stop breathing whenever they go to apply brush-to-miniature. Keep breathing, and always brace your forearms against something to help keep them steady.

ALWAYS, ALWAYS clean your airbrush after each session! Always run a jar of methylated spirits mixed with a little hot water through your gun, and gently clean the end with a soft toothbrush. Every few sessions, carefully dismatle the tip and clean it completely. This will keep the flow of paint through the gun nice and smooth!

Rob Cruse (a.k.a. "Jester") has a number of excellent tutorials at his website, among which are a few very handy tips for airbrushing! These are well worth taking the time to look at!

Tommy. 8)

Cheers guys

I spoke to a guy who works with my dad, and he said basically what you guys said

One last question; When thinning, he recommened 1/2 water 1/2 Metho as your thinning mix. What do you guys think? :-D

That sounds a bit extreme to me, metho + acylics won't promote an even coverage, i wouldn't think.

But i'm in the dark on this too as i don't own an airbrush but do own a number of unpainted tanks. . .

Good thread, keep the replies comming peeps!

Matisse Derivan recommends the thinners to be 9 parts water and 1 part surface tension breaker for all their acrylic paint. Both the Derivan Minis and the Matisse flow range have been made with airbrushing in mind.
(Surface tension breaker inproves the flow of paint)

Tamiya is a old style solvent based acrylic, you have to buy special thinners.

I've asked my cousin Chris to give me an answer to some of your questions. He has been making plastic kits for over 35 years and always used Tamiya paints. He has recently changed to Derivan Minis, partcularly for the airbrushing.

He has every WWII Japanese model ship on display at his home and a large number of US model ships, aircraft, and military models.

I will post his response when I recevie it.

:cool:



To be honest mate, I wouldn't be mixing these paints with metho. Use your metho to clean your airbrush, rather than to paint with. Your best rule of thumb, especially when you're starting out, is to whenever possible use the thinner designed for the actual paint-brand you're using. They're not all formulated the same, and usually companies recommend using a thinner which will work best with the chemicals used in their paints. So for Tamiya, use Tamiya. For Gunze-Sangyo, use Gunze-Sangyo. These both have readily available thinners which are cheap, and a large bottle will last you a long time. For Vallejo and Reaper, I'd recommend using Derivan Surface Tenmsion Breaker for your thinning, or Windsor-and-Newton flow improver (*this last one can be a little pricey, unfortunately). Thin it to about the consistency of milk, and go for a couple of fine, even coats.

Once you've got a basic idea of what you're doing with your airbrush, then you can start playing around with different concoctions. In all, find whatever gets you the result you're happiest with.

Tommy. :-D

Actaully, speaking of metho and airbrushing, a bloke at the local club used to use GW paints mixed with metho. No idea on what the ratio was, but he said he never had any problems with the gun clogging, and the paint dried really fast cause metho evaporates alot faster than water.

Just some food for thought.

Hope this helps

Derivan Minis
Very matt finish, good leveling qualities, very fine pigmentation for airbrushing, will not hide detail due to pigment size.

AIRBRUSHING
One of the specifications for Derivan minis was that it could be used successfully for airbrushing miniatures and models. (Same as Matisse flow)

Thinning for airbrushing
In regards to using the surface tension breaker and water as thinners.
diluted 1 part with 9 parts water, to thin the paint to the desired viscosity.
The airbrush artist will find that far less water is required to achieve the same viscosity (as "chemical thinning" has taken place); therefore the colours will be far stronger and more intense than if the paint had just been "let down" with water alone. "

In regards to pigment particle size
The pigments used in the Deraivan Mini have been milled down to a particle size small enough to easily flow through the finest of airbrushes.

Because of the very fine particle size, Derivan Mini can be used with the smallest tip or needle size, as fine as 0.1

Clogging
If the airbrush appears to be clogging regularly, add a few drops of Drying Retarder to the mixture and this will help to slow the drying time.

Matisse Flow range
Matisse Flow Formula is designed to allow free flowing brushstrokes or use through an airbrush (with minimal dilution). This allows the paint to be used for fine brushwork with or without water dilution. This paint gives a fine flow with a low-sheen finish and good levelling. (A slight satin finish)

Matisse Flow Formula has been especially designed with the airbrush artist in mind.

Matisse Flow Formula will dry waterfast and lightfast. It is suitable for all airbrush work including illustration, fine art, cartoon work, graphic design and mural work.

Matisse Flow Formula can also be used for automotive detail work when covered by a protective clear lacquer, and has been used extensively in the automotive design area. Clear automotive lacquers can be used over the top of Matisse Flow to give a tough weatherproof finish normally associated with automotive finishes.

All other points are the same as the Derivan Minis.

Note
For best results both Derivan minis, Matisse Flow and Vallejo recommend priming (undercoating the model first) For Vallejo see their air model range of paints (designed for airbrushing) and go to the air model user guide.

Derivan mini will give you a very matt finish.
Matisse Flow will give you a slight satin finish.

I use both.

:cool:



**This stuff sounds REALLY good. I will definitely give this a try! Thanks Tyberius!

Tommy. 8)

Wow, so many replies.

I trialed the 50/50 metho to water, and made it one part metho-mix to paint, and find the paint just runs. I was going to try a one part metho or water mix to about three or four parts paint, as the colour is too liquid.

I have found it is still quite hard to basecoat models with the airbrush, as the precision is not that great. Is it possible to buy more of a precision 'head' for the airbrush, or is that out of the question?

So I am now going for milk consistency - right?

That depends largely on the airbrush. Cheapie models don't really have detachable heads, but you can usually adjust paint flow by turning the end to tighten up or loosen the tip, increasing or decreasing the paint flow. Also, check the air pressure. Too much or little air will make painting tricky.

However, usually it's a matter of practice, practice, practice.

Just a few notes on the difference between Derivan minis and Matisse flow.

Matisse flow is an artist range of paints, the colours will NOT have an opaque agent added, it will be pure pigment. So if the pigment is by nature transparent or semi transparent then you will definitely need a white undercoat.

This is why yellows and reds in any range have trouble going over a black undercoat. The pigments for yellows and reds are naturally transparent. Ultramarine blue pigment is semi transparent and funny enough many brown pigments are either naturally transparent or semi transparent.

Hobby paints have an opaque agent added to improved coverage, they are not pure pigment.

Derivan Minis have had an opaque agent added to improve coverage. This was done because the hobby needs the coverage especially for black undercoating. For brightness of colour a white undercoat is still preferable particularly where the pigments are naturally transparent in nature. (Mark Fenlon has always varied his undercoat using both black or white on a miniature depending on what colour he was going to use and I’ve been experimenting with this over the last two years.)

Many Derivan Mini colours go over a black undercoat, particular the white which is amazing, but I fine a white undercoat is best in general.

Here is one coat of Derivan Mini Spartan red over a black undercoat of a 1/72nd scale plastic Celt. (not airbrushed)


My cousin Chris first airbrushed with Derivan Minis last year using Battleship grey directly on a plastic kit, model ship. He has used Derivan minis ever since, because:

- the thinners is 9 parts water and one part surface tension breaker, he does NOT have to buy special thinners for it and the surface tension breaker will last for a long time.
- He has not experienced any problem with over spray, and paint running when using Derivan mini.
- The paint drying time is very quick based on his experience when compared to Tamiya which has been his preferred brand for more than 30 years.

A 1/72nd scale Chaffee by Chris


A ship airbrushed using Derivan minis and the water effect was using Matisse gel medim


(I will gets some new pictures of his models when I see him next)

I understand Vallejo also uses surface tension breaker and water to thin down their paint for airbrushing. (Both Vallejo and Matisse manufacture and sell specialist artist paints, same type of manufacturing background)

Both Vallejo and Matisse recommend undercoating to get the best results when airbrushing. My cousin Chris found this out when trying to airbrush with the Derivan Sherwood green. It needed a white undercoat to bring out the colour.

You can find the Vallejo undercoating recommendation on
http://www.acrylicosvallejo.com/
click on miniatures and model colours,
then click on model air and
then click on user guide to find a step by step guide to airbrushing.

Matisse have a little black book with tips for artists on airbrushing, marbling, cracking paint etc. It is worth hunting one up, many of the tips provided can be worked into our hobby.

Good luck with the airbrushing.